DX3 will actually be a prequel!

Post by **DDL** » Tue Oct 07, 2008 7:41 am

chris the cynic wrote: I have never liked the stance that we should judge things in isolation when the things are not isolated. The phrase, "When compared to [original] it might not be good but it's an excellent [thing] in its own right," should never be used to counter a negative assessment of a derivative work.

Fair point, of course...but that still in no way invalidates the fact that something may well be an excellent [thing] in its own right.

That a game may be "a great game in isolation" in no way excuses the fact it's (for example) a shitty deus ex game, but also being a shitty deus ex game in no way prevents it being "a great game in isolation".

Post by **Jonas** » Tue Oct 07, 2008 9:36 am

I'm mainly worried about the aesthetics right now. I didn't much fancy the look of Invisible War (not sufficiently grounded in the real world), and making a prequel would be a perfect opportunity to bring the realistic look back to the franchise, but instead we got what seems to be The Fifth Element as a prequel to Blade Runner, which just doesn't seem right. I don't want to sound prejudiced against the French, I love that particular French art culture that you can always recognize by how different it is from everything produced by the American Cultural Empire, but Deus Ex is a very American dystopia, and French artfulness has no place in it.

Anyway, cultural bias mostly aside, I don't think we can judge the game's story yet, Mr. Cyberpunk. They've basically told us nothing about it except it'll be a prequel, you'll start as a generic security guard, and they're really trying to implement a multilayered, responsive storyline with a very important social aspect. Whether they live up to that remains to be seen and will remain to be seen until the game is released, but since it is a prequel, we might as well assume it'll tie into DX's story somehow.

Post by **metche_steele** » Tue Oct 07, 2008 10:00 am

Jonas wrote:... you'll start as a generic security guard...

Oooh! I really hope i'm called Barney!!

Post by **Jonas** » Tue Oct 07, 2008 10:37 am

The protagonist is Adam Jensen. Please try to keep up.

Post by **DDL** » Tue Oct 07, 2008 11:07 am

"Might as well start using your codename, Jensen."

Metche can be actually called Barney if she wants to.

Post by **Jonas** » Tue Oct 07, 2008 11:15 am

What makes you so sure of that? They haven't said anything about naming.

Phasmatis · Post by **Phasmatis** » Tue Oct 07, 2008 11:42 am

This isn't good or bad news, just news for those who haven't seen it. There's a thread on the Eidos forums asking if there will be an SDK.

René wrote:I think it's too early to say. At least, I can't confirm anything right now, sorry.

Which is good in the sense he didn't say there was no hope in there being an SDK.

chris the cynic · Post by **chris the cynic** » Tue Oct 07, 2008 1:06 pm

What concerns me about the asthetic isn't a question of getting there, it's a question of getting there and back to Deus Ex athestic in the time allotted.

That, and the fact that it seems to be a concious effort to completely betray the feel of Deus Ex. There's a place for this asthetic, but Jonas is right Deus Ex has no place for it.

justanotherfan · Post by **justanotherfan** » Tue Oct 07, 2008 8:12 pm

Exactly. It doesn't fit. It won't. The only way I could see them doing it is by having it set in Shanghai, and have a couple of levels be exact duplicates of DX1's New York or Paris etc; That might imply that China becomes extremely prosperous far beyond the USA. While the USA in DX1 had the gritty cyberpunk feel, it was also run down, yet the implication was that the USA was still the superpower in that American game. Renaissance won't be cyberpunk. This won't be Deus Ex.

I think that's fine. Eidos proved that doing a sequel to Deus Ex is incredibly difficult. This time they're supposedly putting in more money and effort and time, so I think it'll turn out well. I don't think this will be a Deus Ex, yet they're taking everything from DX. That should create an awesome game. Chris is right that they've set Deus Ex as the benchmark and they're playing with the Deus Ex script, so I'm sure they'll be rightfully blamed if the game isn't good enough, especially if it's because it strays too far from the original's strengths.

BTW, the French Canadians are a bit different from the French. I won't say much about it since I'm in the West, so I think many of the cultural biases still apply, but the dialects are different and they like to be considered independent of the culture of France. If you need a nice way of thinking of them, they're Canadians, but a bit more European

. If that's too difficult, they're the French with a new-world head start on cosmopolitanism. Still, I imagine DX3 will be done Right, even if it means DX1 was Wrong

.

AgentSmithereens · Post by **AgentSmithereens** » Tue Oct 07, 2008 8:20 pm

Having actually read the article, I'm even more excited than from just reading people's summaries and comments, and from looking at the pictures. In particular, this sounds really cool:

While the development team was reluctant to say too much at this point, it did reveal that psychology and body language would play a major role in your conversations. By watching an NPPC's body language and the manner in which they speak, you'll have to ascertain not only which response is the most effective, but the manner in which you deliver it.

Post by **Jonas** » Tue Oct 07, 2008 8:24 pm

They've been furiously hiring people from France though, as far as I know. The cultural products I've seen out of French Canada have been noticeably French in their aesthetics. Assassin's Creed is the example that comes to mind.

justanotherfan · Post by **justanotherfan** » Tue Oct 07, 2008 10:05 pm

The article will hype it. After reading it, I was excited too. They're making a new game in the DX series, and they have a lot done. I think the discussion is more important though, since the journalists/editors have the same interests as the developers in making the game sound exciting. It's their 200th issue IIRC, and DX is on the cover. They want to sell magazines. It's a lot like when Tomshardware goes to see the Chenbro factory, and suddenly Chenbro makes the most awesome cases ever. The discussion boils down what facts were given, and how it relates to the DX world/community at large.

True, Jonas. They tie their culture close to France because they don't want to be assimilated or lose that culture. They just don't like being dismissed as French, and want to be something different. I didn't know about the hiring of people from France. That could make for an interesting office dynamic

. I'm thinking something like Americans in London.

Post by **Jonas** » Tue Oct 07, 2008 10:11 pm

justanotherfan wrote:They just don't like being dismissed as French, and want to be something different.

Well then we have a conflict of interest, because I like to dismiss them as French.

Don't quote me on the hiring, I don't remember how I got that impression.

Dead-eye · Post by **Dead-eye** » Tue Oct 07, 2008 11:12 pm

Mr_Cyberpunk wrote: What people dislike is when they buy a game thinking its something.. only to have it as something else entirely

Yeah I have a feeling that I will like Deus Ex 3 because I will play it fully expecting it to disappoint me as much as IW... but that's imposable because you can't die on the inside twice.

Jonas wrote:I'm mainly worried about the aesthetics right now. I didn't much fancy the look of Invisible War (not sufficiently grounded in the real world), and making a prequel would be a perfect opportunity to bring the realistic look back to the franchise, but instead we got what seems to be The Fifth Element as a prequel to Blade Runner, which just doesn't seem right. I don't want to sound prejudiced against the French, I love that particular French art culture that you can always recognize by how different it is from everything produced by the American Cultural Empire, but Deus Ex is a very American dystopia, and French artfulness has no place in it.

I have a feeling like the Dev's are not that dumb. Most likely when you travel to other places it will start to look more and more like Deus Ex one did. Everywhere you went in Deus Ex was Ground Zero for MJ12 and the Gray Death. There had to be some places that MJ12 set aside to be prosperous for the people MJ12 controlled and they probably look totally different then the US witch was border line 3ed world in Deus Ex 1.

AgentSmithereens wrote:Having actually read the article, I'm even more excited than from just reading people's summaries and comments, and from looking at the pictures. In particular, this sounds really cool:
While the development team was reluctant to say too much at this point, it did reveal that psychology and body language would play a major role in your conversations. By watching an NPPC's body language and the manner in which they speak, you'll have to ascertain not only which response is the most effective, but the manner in which you deliver it.

Marketers have a tendency to over exaggerate things. They said the same thing about Mass Effect.

Smike · Post by **Smike** » Wed Oct 08, 2008 1:32 am

Dream, boys and girls. Dream of the fairies in the land of sugar-pop-licorice-bunnies. Dream of the cream fountains in the valley of caramel. Dream of coconut-pineapple mountains and chocolate rivers with sausage-pancake sandbars and rolling boulders of Danish danishes. Dream of mapley-syrupy-rain falling on ham and croissant fields...

* dreams *