Just had an idea.

There are certain areas like Liberty Island which will look terrible no matter what high res textures, normal maps and whatnot get crammed into the game, partly due to the fact that they're huge and empty. Modifying the level geometry is probably out of question, since there's enough work to do for the mods as is.

What about adding more objects(in the case of Liberty Island some more plants, trees, trash lying around or whatever)? I'm not proposing huge changes, but putting some more objects in areas that are too empty in a way that doesn't impact on gameplay too much(so not more powerups like munitions and stuff). I haven't done much work in UnrealEd beyond some playing around so I'm probably talking bollocks anyways, since that'd probably screw up AI pathfinding or something.

I was inspired after browsing some sites for the RPG Gothic, some people also created high res texture and object packs and there's a guy who's playing around with detailing the Gothic world that way and from what I read that method is somewhat tame on the timerequiring part.

Would that method be actually feasable?

Well, to be honest: liberty island is empty. It's a big fucking island with a surprisingly small statue on a huge fucking pedestal...and not much else.

So you know: at least they were being reasonably faithful to reality.

Personally, I've never thought of liberty island as empty: it's jampacked with NSF, for a start..

I was just using Liberty Island as example since it's so empty, but there's a bunch of other places like that too. I haven't been there so I don't know if it's that dull in reality too.

I didn't propose huge changes like adding new architecture or anything, so it'll remain pretty dull if you like that The island seems kinda deserted, and with the Liberty statue being blown up and the world in recession I doubt the place would be cared for much. So it'd kinda make sense for it to have some wildgrowing bushes and tufts, and dirt like old newspapers and whatnot to be about on that place. So you'd add only more of the props that are already there for that certain area.

I just want to know if it's actually possible and feasable. Since if yes it'd be a relatively easy way to make some areas that actually'd require the levelgeometry to be overhauled to be more detailed without changing the gameplay and general appearence.

Not a bad idea. Modding Deus Ex in this way like how people mod Morrowind is completely feasible. On a separate note, is it that complicated to mod what items do and all that? Only Shifter appears to, and I have reservations about using it since I really don't like how it handles skill points.

Guys, is not so simple as it looks.
First of all, the Liberty Island is one of my favorite DX levels and is looking just fine.
Secondly, the Liberty Island is one of the biggest DX levels (significant number of polygons).
This level already had many frame rate issues on the hardware (CPU and GPU) available 8 years ago.
More details means lower frame rate on a mid-range computer.

These days, any moron is able to create a FPS game: is buying the most powerful 3D engine on the market,
is pushing 500,000 - 1,000,000 polygons and 500 high-res textures per level and "voila", the bullshit can be published.
For these "skilled" developers it doesn't matter if you need a Core 2 Extreme and a GTX 280 in order to get a decent frame rate.

God, you people don't seem what I mean.

First as already said(the second time now) I just used Liberty Island as an example. If it's perfect as it is, I am sure there are other areas in Deus Ex that could benefit from that kind of treatment. Maybe at least.

No one is talking about changing the levels architecture or layout. There aren't going to be new walls, buildings, crate stacks, giant construction equipment or gameplay related things like ATM's, inventory items or whatever. What's going to be added in that scenario are items that don't have an impact on gameplay. And it's only small things, small details. So in any case it'll be only increasing the level of detail on a small scale.

So in the case of Liberty Island(which I just used as an example )it won't look really different. There'd just be some more small plants here and there, a couple more old papers, dirt and debris lying around. And not in excessive amounts so you wouldn't have to fear to be buried under a mountain of old newspapers or something.
In the case of a bar like in New York, Hong Kong or Paris you could add some more empty bottles here and there and some more potted plants, although non pickable things would be better since they'd have even less gameplay impact.

I don't have DX installed but maybe later I can whip a picture of what I'm meaning up in Truespace, since pictures say more than thousand words.

Hope I didn't come off as demeaning or angry, just wanted to clarify what I'm saying since the vibe I'm getting feels like " I don't understand what that fellow's talking about".



Thankfully, we have now better hardware available than 8 years ago. Even with high res textures of NV and the high detail models of HDTP and god knows what other features are yet to come, most even nowadays older systems will be able to run Dx with the upgrades in place without a hassle. Ranting about the limiting factors of 8 years ago is pointless, since these hardware limits are mostly history now(engine limits are another story, but some of them have already been ironed out). If the upgrade mods were to adhere the hardware limits of eight years ago they'd be pointless.

I get you. You want to add some things like an extra bin/bench here and there, maybe a bush or a broken crate. Just to add "details" to the level. I'm sure that won't push the polygon count so much that a modern PC or UEd will die a horrible death.

Did I say anything about levels architecture and new buildings?



And I just told you that all those "minor" items mean lower frame rate.
(especially if they're detailed).



Ranting?
I just told you the technical reasons for that "empty" Liberty Island.

On the top of that, I'm sure Super Mario using the Far Cry 2 ("Dunia") engine cannot offer a better gameplay.

You mention low spec machines, but considering that DE ran well on a Celeron 350MHz, adding a few hundred/thousand polygons to Liberty Island isn't going to make a difference to current gen low spec machines.

So you're basically adding a lot more decorations and trashgenerators to levels. Which is fair enough I guess, but unless you're going to distribute modified levels yourself (which is questionable, legally), you're probably going to spawn them in at runtime using a modified missionscript, or something. Which means adding things to a level yourself, noting exactly where you added it and it's rotation, and then writing context-specific spawn statements into the missionscript for that map for each separate addition.

It's just...a shitload of work, really. I know I wouldn't have the patience.

So it's not really feasable. That's just what I wanted to know, thanks

I'd just like to add that newer versions of the unreal engine do grass and landscaping far better. Liberty Island is really boring because it's a large flat area with well trimmed grass (eg. flat grass on flat ground). DXR changes the engine, making new details possible.

DXR won't add anything like that I think. When HDTP and NV and DXR are done, I think people will see an incredible amount of potential for improving DX, and it'll actually be possible with the newer engine. Think UT2003's Antalus level.

Modifying the levels is a lot of work. Deus Ex...Reloaded IIRC is working on redoing all the levels. So it would be feasible to improve the originals -- just a lot of work.

I don't see what's so bad with Liberty Island, and it's most definitely the flattest level in the game.
Also Liberty Island is just BARELY running in Unreal as it is. Seriously, it's on the outer brink of what UnrealEd is willing to compile and the engine willing to run. >_>;

Correction, DX: Revision.

Lordy, how many DX:R-acronymed projects are there?

There should be an international governing body for Deus Ex mod acronym allocation, or something.